[Feb 7, 2007] - How do Tradeskills work in Fallen Earth?

[Acropolis]

How do Tradeskills work in Fallen Earth?

That's a big question. Let's break it down some:

The List of Tradeskills:
First off, there are 11 core tradeskills in the game:

Armorcraft: Making all manner of clothes and armor.
Ballistics: Making rifles, pistols, crossbows, zip guns, bullets, and similar equipment used for killing at range.
Cooking: Creating food that can help increase player performance primarily through the recovery of hit points and stamina faster (characters who don't have some food in their gut and a quenched thirst are going to be able to act fine, but will find their time spent recovering from injuries or exhaustion much longer).
Genetics: Creating tools that increase the effectiveness of mutations.
Geology: Recovering minerals from the earth.
Medicine: Making first aid kits, anti-venoms, radiation treatments, etc.
Nature: Making poisons, collecting materials from plants and animals, refining tradeskill components, etc.
Scavenging: Allows for harvesting materials from the piles of junk that dot the Grand Canyon.
Science: Making acids, sniper scopes, batteries, cars, refining tradeskill components, etc.
Teaching: Creating books so you can teach others.
Weaponry: Making clubs, knives, baseball bats, and other killing implements that are used up close and personal.

A player can learn as many tradeskills as they want, but due to the time component required to raise them (see below) it will be hard to master more than a handful. All players start with basic levels in all tradeskills, so all players can learn a handful of recipes from each tradeskill and decide what they want to concentrate on.

Getting Components:

Basically players will collect components from scavenging, harvesting minerals, plants, or animals, breaking down existing items, or from creature drops. Scavenging and harvesting plants and minerals will be done by interacting with nodes that spawn in appropriate areas throughout the world. These can vary from special mutant cacti that produce healing salves to getting bits of rubber from piles of old tires. Creatures can be skinned to get items such as leather, meat, bone, toxins (giant spiders!), or acid (giant ants!).

Most creatures in the game will drop components as loot as opposed to finished items, encouraging players to make items instead of simply camping spawns until you get equipment you can use, though creatures will drop finished goods as well. A character who equips himself completely from drops is not going to have equipment as good as the character who gets his through tradeskills, either by making them himself or buying them from others. Some rare tradeskill items will require rare components that can only be acquired from certain rare spawns, but getting the finished item still requires the participation of a crafter. So really to get the best gear in the game a crafter is probably going to be involved at some point.

We have an extensive list of components, everything from Tainted Meat to Scrap Copper to Strong Antibiotics to Ragged Kevlar. Components exist in different quality levels, such as Scrap Copper versus Salvaged Copper. Characters will be able to improve the quality of components (or create components from other components) through the use of Science and Nature.

Also, players will be able to break down existing items to get some of their component parts.

Getting Recipes:

Characters do not learn individual recipes in Fallen Earth; instead they learn groups of recipes called a Knowledges (Knowledges are also used to teach things like combat abilities or mutation powers). Each Tradeskill Knowledge has one or more related recipes that the player learns when they acquire the knowledge. For example if you learn Axe, a Weaponry Knowledge, you'll learn to make a number of axes with different abilities. If you learn T-Shirt, an Armorcraft Knowledge, you'll learn a number of different T-Shirt recipes, each of a different color so you can customize your appearance. Each recipe requires a different list of components.

Knowledges can be gained from four different sources:

Missions: Some missions will provide Knowledges as a reward. These are normally special Knowledges that can only be gained through that mission. These are spread throughout the game with at least one in every town (we are going to have literally hundreds of towns over the course of the game), so if you want to learn every last crafting recipes for a given skill, it will take a lot of travel.
Trainers: Trainers in towns will sell books that teach common, readily available knowledges. Not all Knowledges will be available at all trainers (good luck finding a well-supplied Science trainer in a CHOTA town).
Treasure Books: These can be found on some mobs, such as crazy technology-worshiping cultists, or in containers that players discover.
Teaching: Players with the Teaching tradeskill can teach Knowledges they already know to other players by creating their own Knowledge books. Not all Knowledges will be able to be taught in this fashion, but most will.

Using Tradeskills

Okay, you've got components and a recipe, so now you can make an item. Basically you can select to make any recipe you know and have components for, and you will immediately begin making that item. Most items can be made while you are doing other things such as fighting or exploring, but some particularly large objects may require you to stand still or not have anything in your hands. Each item takes real time to make, varying from anywhere from a few minutes for a basic items like food or medkits, to a few hours for weapons or armor, to several weeks for cars. This time passes if you are logged in or not. You can queue up a number of items to complete while you are logged off. For each item you make, your tradeskill increases by a variable amount depending on the complexity of the item. Also, you gain experience for crafting items, allowing characters to level up completely by crafting if they wish (though this will take a long time and you have to go out into the world to find many of the recipes) but you only gain experience for crafting done while online.

A character can decrease the time it takes to make an item by staying in a crafting facility, such as a workshop or a kitchen, appropriate to the tradeskill they are using. Really complex items may require the character to remain in the facility for the entire time the item is under construction.

Improving Tradeskills

Tradeskills improve each time you make an item that is still a challenge to you, in other words somewhat near your level. The gain varies on the time and resources spent on the item.

Like all skills, tradeskills are governed by attributes that limit how high you can raise them. Tradeskills are limited by Perception and Intelligence, meaning if you want to be a master crafter you have to max out your Perception and Intelligence. Characters can get far in tradeskills without doing so, but will never be the best.

ENJOY!

~Acropolis

[Stowaway]

Woohoo

Information!! :D

[Denser]

Huge thanks for all of the information in this post, some of it will undoubtedly aid some of the 'debates' that have been raging for a while, especially about the scavenging component, again thank you ^_^

[ordeith]

Awesome! this made my week! Information!

http://www.misspoppy.com/catalog/img/products/magnet/im_happy.jpg

And I'm in love with the "time-based" tradeskilling. <3

[Taelanna]

Oh! I really, really like! :D

Thanks very much, Acropolis.

Peace, Tae

[Tomb]

Miza liki!

[Acropolis]

Well, thanks to the dev team for taking the time to get this together for me. :)

[GRiM]

I love gathering every last little tidbit of info i can...

Thx alot man:D

[Sboyle12500]

a system like this is why I love this dev team, long live Icarus, thats all I can really say

[Taelanna]

Well, thanks to the dev team for taking the time to get this together for me. :)

Most definately! Never meant to leave them out of the thank yous at all! I know all of us appreciate their hard work and we wait with bated breath for any details they're willing to part with. :)

Peace, Tae

[ordeith]

Well, thanks to the dev team for taking the time to get this together for me. :)

*places his crowbar and trashcan-shield on the ground and kneels in front of the dev-shrine with lowered head, giving his respect to the almighty /dev/null*

[RamonSterns]

Whoop-ti-do! :)

[Mo0k]

Woo! Loving this, thanks a lot, Acro-man! :D

[Liberate]

wow.. i'm never playing an mmo from another company ever, ever again.

[gibal]

awsome info a lot of people wil be very happy with this.

[andreeon]

thanks for the info on crafting i know i cant wait until i start to craft so i can make and get known on FE to be one of the crafters to know in game for things made
andreeon

[Unixtam]

22:15 < Tam_> "breaking down existing items"
22:15 < Tam_> swee
22:15 < Tam_> t
22:16 < Tam_> destruction is of use.. i always knew destruction is something good...
22:17 < Tam_> "Knowledges are also used to teach things like combat abilities"
22:17 < Tam_> great
22:18 < Tam_> "(we are going to have literally hundreds of towns over the course of the game)"
22:18 < Tam_> LOVE
22:20 < Tam_> ut you only gain experience for crafting done while online.
22:20 < Tam_> bleeeh
22:21 < Tam_> "limited by Perception and Intelligence"
22:21 < Tam_> crafter alt...

from irc.echo34.com #fallenearth.se - join now! :)


~
Tam

[Andrexea]

Defentally love the sound of how crafting will work!!

[suske]

i think the crafters from swg have found a new home freakin' sweet!

[medic238]

A-crop,

I'm truly, truly impressed. Huzzah to you and the rest of the team!

[suske]

Well, thanks to the dev team for taking the time to get this together for me. :)


yes indeed. much thanks to the icarus dev team!

where do i send the smokes and beers?:D

[exarx]

This is indeed Great news!
the tradeskill system is even greater than i could imagine!
this game will indeed be second to no other game!

[Haruhi]

Mr. Polis, I think I love you :eek:

[zainredding]

Thanx Guys. Good Info.

[Voight]

Obligatory thank-you post.

[grayclay88]

How do Tradeskills work in Fallen Earth?
Getting Recipes:

Characters do not learn individual recipes in Fallen Earth; instead they learn groups of recipes called a Knowledges (Knowledges are also used to teach things like combat abilities or mutation powers). Each Tradeskill Knowledge has one or more related recipes that the player learns when they acquire the knowledge. For example if you learn Axe, a Weaponry Knowledge, you'll learn to make a number of axes with different abilities. If you learn T-Shirt, an Armorcraft Knowledge, you'll learn a number of different T-Shirt recipes, each of a different color so you can customize your appearance. Each recipe requires a different list of components.


I...I...I think im in love!!

I have a question, if you get affiliated with a certain faction, will your ability in that tradeskill increase? Will Techs get you Science, Enforcers Weaponry/Armor/Ballistics, Vistas nature, etc.?

[Stedfast]

Most excellent makes one almost want to be a Tech totally:)

[Zena]

Great to see this. Lots of new ideas. Here's another question, or rather clarification, if you can manage it.

"Also, you gain experience for crafting items, allowing characters to level up completely by crafting if they wish (though this will take a long time and you have to go out into the world to find many of the recipes) but you only gain experience for crafting done while online."

The way this is worded seems to imply that you gain adventuring experience when you craft, rather than crafting XP. Otherwise, why bother to mention it here? Or are they just saying you can level as a crafter, gaining only crafting XP, and never have to engage in combat? Or am I completely befuddled? Yes, I'm completely befuddled. That's it. :confused:

Nevertheless, it looks great so far.

[Breagha]

Crafting and tradeskills look so awesome!! I want to make a library, the moment player housing is implemented!! (if player housing gets implemented :p)

Great info, and thanks a lot :D

[Oriin]

MMMM information urge to play the game rising :)

Thank you Acropolis and to you devs team :D

[DarkTreader]

...
...
...

freakin. wow.

That's all I can say... just freakin wow...

And I'm with suske, where do we send the smokes and beers? Because this is one DAMNED fine system.

----

Zena - I think what was meant in the post about XP was something like this (though I may be wrong)... You can gain levels from the XP gained by crafting -AND- your tradeskills improve. That way, pure crafters can stand around and do naught but craft, and still get XP rewards from it. Otherwise, you'd have a whole segment of crafter alts that are stuck at L1 with their tradeskills sky high.

----

And just y'all remember... you need specialty weapons or armor, you come visit DT's Guns an' Stuff-to-Stop-Guns-From-Hurting-You Shop! :)

[Stedfast]

Thanks alot for the information Acropolis and the Devs that aided you, super stuff:)

[Unixtam]

So.. am I the only one who thinks that crafting will be for alts only since you wanna shoot something up? See.. perception and intelligence is somewhat required for your tradeskills, but you'd need your AP for other skills to be an efficient killer. So it sounds like "frag em up or craft" afterall.... don't you think so?


~
Tam

[Breagha]

*shrugs* I'll be building my char as she is ICly... But I realize for a lot of people it'll only be about getting the uberest template. I figure each to their own.

[nimrod]

omg soo nice .. im going to be a Genetics maybe some small in weopan so make melee.. :D

[Darkaster]

Thanks Po-lis!

This is some great news, I really can't wait. Seriously, I am unable to wait, so... In order to avoid a medical emergency... :D

[Growaidun]

Very cool. Professor Emmett Felstaud is now officially a shut-in Tech.

[Snorkel]

:D thank you Icarus... very fine system youve got there on paper, cant wait to see how it plays... though i am shocked, this might be the first game where i actualy *gasp* enjoy crafting... me is a happy gammer :p

[RalpGalland]

:D thank you Icarus... very fine system youve got there on paper, cant wait to see how it plays... though i am shocked, this might be the first game where i actualy *gasp* enjoy crafting... meesa happy gammer :p

*Shoots Snorkel*

No Gungans!! No friggin gungans!!

[grayclay88]

<-- Science, Ballistics and Genetics

You should be able to combine tradeskills. If you have armorsmithing and science, you can put armor on your car, if you have weaponsmithing you can put blades, ballistics gets a gun.

[Alter]

So.. am I the only one who thinks that crafting will be for alts only since you wanna shoot something up? See.. perception and intelligence is somewhat required for your tradeskills, but you'd need your AP for other skills to be an efficient killer. So it sounds like "frag em up or craft" afterall.... don't you think so?

Actually Tam the system seems to work to counter the idea of crafter alts or at least you'll have to put as much work into your alt as your main.

...you only gain experience for crafting done while online.

Tradeskills improve each time you make an item that is still a challenge to you, in other words somewhat near your level.

So APs for other non-tradeskills don't seem to be used to raise tradeskills. I could be wrong.

I can kinda see your point about Perception and Intelligence being needed but I'd counter that with, only if your trying to make the ultimate 100% combat build in which case tradeskills are redundant for that build anyway. Maybe Perception is also needed for some combat skills, maybe Intelligence is as well....who knows?

From this brief glimpse behind the scenes I reckon the reqs for crafting won't be anything more than a minor blip for the vast majority of players. It looks like crafters won't be stuck in a shack somewhere doing their thing because they can't survive if they step outside.

I like it.....a lot. :D

[Sroek]

Are tools, factories, or fabrication devices elements of crafting?

[Alter]

Good question Sroek. I hadn't considered the need for an appropriate 'toolkit' for a given tradeskill.

A character can decrease the time it takes to make an item by staying in a crafting facility, such as a workshop or a kitchen, appropriate to the tradeskill they are using. Really complex items may require the character to remain in the facility for the entire time the item is under construction.

Is a partial answer for factories though I think crafting will be more of a workshop thing than a full blown factory at least for awhile.

[Khurdy]

So much information, thanks!

[Monker]

Really complex items may require the character to remain in the facility for the entire time the item is under construction.


Hmm, I wonder if when making such items, there will be other things to do around the shop, or will progress just stop when you're not in the shop.

[Kev Lee]

*Drool* Sweet... *Wipes drool*

[Chirix]

the more information I get, the more difficult it becomes to wait 'till the release...

Big thanks to Acropolis and dev team.

[Phenix]

One answer per week ? 2007 is a very nice year for Fallen Earth :)

[Richardb]

Then hopefully they wont be answering too many questions before release :p

[Performer]

REAL Information ! :eek:
That means I'll have to start posting...

1. Big Thanks, Icarus ! I love weekly Updates. :)

2. A minor Concern that can most likely be squashed by a little Clarification - and it might spawn some Discussion, too.

Also, you gain experience for crafting items [...] for crafting done while online.Crafting-Skills go up through crafting Stuff, so I guess Shooting-Skills will go up through shooting Stuff. Experience (-> Levels) most likely allows you to raise Attributes or get new Abilities - therefore either benefitting crafting or fighting or both. Now as I can craft simple Items while doing whatever I like, and get XP for it, wouldn't that suggest purely-fighting-Powergamers to pick up Crafting and have it run in the Background ? Just to maximize XP-gain ?
Ok, most likely, all the Recipies that don't obstruct you in a Firefight will only give a little XP and be insignificant (XP-wise) after a rather short time. ...but if not ?

Also:
...but you only gain experience for crafting done while online.Isn't that Rule goining to generate a lot of AFK-Zombies ? ... hmm ...wasn't there someone asking for Zombies anyway ? :rolleyes:


Conclusion: I don't buy the XP-Gain through Crafting yet. Nice idea, sure - but exploitable it seems...

[Major Scientist]

Conclusion: I don't buy the XP-Gain through Crafting yet. Nice idea, sure - but exploitable it seems...

Welcome to the land of powergamers, if there's an exploit they will find it.
I think it was mentioned on the MOGArmy video that crafting AP and "skill" AP will be kept seperate. Is both affecting attributes a problem? Well, we have mechanics with deft hands, does that automatically mean they're deadeyes with handguns?

And finally, solid info for crafters. Did I mention I love this game? :)

[Kavis]

I am loving this crafting system... reminds me alot of the original SWG crafting system/economy. And IMO SWG originally had the best economic system/model in an MMORPG so far.

[sinoth]

This sounds amazing. I'm so excited :D

[Kitsunelady]

I can't *wait* til next week!!!!

[Monker]

How exploitable rests on how macroable, or how strong any anti-macro measures in place in the game are(by macro, I mean full out automation).

But overall, I like where this game is going feature wise.

[Veran]

Absolutely cannot wait for this game. Im serious, client pls :)

I can't *wait* til next week!!!!

What you mean? its coming out next week? O_O

[Cthulhuvong]

What you mean? its coming out next week? O_O

No, but another Question of the Week is :D

[Veran]

No, but another Question of the Week is :D

Ohh, right :)
Awesome.

[grayclay88]

Just had to comment, Veran, nice sig :D

[Veran]

Just had to comment, Veran, nice sig :D
Thanks, just did it up quickly now for this forum :)

[Darkshade]

As an upcomming tech, thanks a lot!

Just what I needed :)

DS

[Dieter Solwolf]

thanks for this infos..

Fianlly it would be nice to have finally a MMO where the best equipement is the crafted one :-)
It's good also to be able to make different colour itesm and seems very open to kind of equipement :-)

Crafted items not being made in one second it's also another good orientation so we will be able to go in exploration during crafting process (and I never seen a rifle produced in less than 10 sec;-)...)

It's not clear if we will need to have professional relation with another crafter to make stuff or if each people could be self-crafter of all parts for an item.. ?

[Faid]

Thankyou for the information, this aspect of the game looks very promising:D

[Monker]

It looks like, from what was said, the only thing preventing you from levelling all of the crafting disciplines, is the time required to do so, as they didn't mention any limitations on how many you could learn.

[Performer]

How exploitable rests on how macroable, or how strong any anti-macro measures in place in the game are(by macro, I mean full out automation).Makros are always problematic, but I'm concerned that XP-for-Crafting can be exploited without such Tools. Well, exploited might be too much, but I'd sure consider it abusive, if People were crafting simple Items Day in Day out, with no Interest in them whatsoever - just for the extra XP-Influx.

[Gems]

*brain explodes*

Wow, I had to read that a couple of times. Any guesses as to how much time(percentage-wise) a character would have to spend crafting? Crafting is a new concept to me, only having CoH to draw from, so I am just trying to wrap my exploding head around it all.

I still have a tonne of information to read too, so if this is a redunant Question, pardon my newbiness.:)

[Monker]

It's not a matter of how much time you have to craft, you craft if you want to. If you never want to bother with it, that's your option, but it may come back to bite you in the end. In games I've played that have crafting, I craft a resonable amount, trying to keep what I can craft close to what I can use.

[Stedfast]

It's not a matter of how much time you have to craft, you craft if you want to. If you never want to bother with it, that's your option, but it may come back to bite you in the end. In games I've played that have crafting, I craft a resonable amount, trying to keep what I can craft close to what I can use.

Indeed crafting is about what you want or what others are willing to pay you for:)

[Zeusfeld]

thanks for this good information about the tradeskills!

[NTragon]

Very good to see that detailed info is being shown at this time.. very interesting aswell. I like the concept.

[Veran]

Very good to see that detailed info is being shown at this time.. very interesting aswell. I like the concept.

Triigo?

tttttt

[Madjorin]

My big question about crafting is alts - have they said anything yet about how many characters we can have? And if we can have more than one character and if characters can continue to craft and raise their skill while offline, can we have all our characters improving their crafting all of the time?

I have to ask because I work my alts like slaves. If the Geneva Convention covered MMOs I'd be a posterboy for badness.

Or will it be like the crafting system that Dragon Empires had planned where you could craft while offline, but only one of your characters at a time could do it?

As much as I get a kick out maintaining a troupe of alt lackeys I kind of hope they will either limit us to one character or limit us to one character crafting at a time.

[DarkTreader]

I'd honestly think that with the time restrictions that are already in place for crafting, not allowing all of your characters to craft simultaneously would just add an additional point of annoyance to the game.

I mean, do you -really- want to have to keep track of:
Alt 1 finishes his gun in 9 hours
Alt 2 can start on his Armor book afterward, for 5 hours
Alt 3 starts on his car after that, for 50 hours

So... 64 hours, when 50 would cover it. I don't see this happening.

[Madjorin]

Seriously if our alts can craft while offline I'd be doing it, no question. I'd squeeze every available crafting hour out of them that I could. I'm ruthless like that. You got 64 hours of crafting done in 50 - I wouldn't settle for less than 140 myself.

But I thought the point of making crafting take time was to introduce a more realistic element and make crafted items more valuable. If everyone has a handful of crafting alts permanently crafting... to balance it out the devs would need to increase the time it takes to craft everything. Or maybe they've already taken that into account.

I'm just curious about how this'll work.

[Breagha]

I don't know about simultaneous crafting - don't remember having read anything about it - but it does say that you won't gain XP for crafting done while offline :)

[Murph]

As much as I get a kick out maintaining a troupe of alt lackeys I kind of hope they will either limit us to one character or limit us to one character crafting at a time.

I agree on this. and why? pure selfless reasons. I want to be a crafter, but if everyone has all craftingskills covered on alts, with maximized intelligens and perception, then what point is there in me being the crafter. There is nothing special about it. Making crafting alts would basicly ruin a lot for me. Why not keep it as a possibel and valued playstyle?

[Stowaway]

I disagree. I do not want there to be only one slot. I do not want crafting to be limited to one toon at a time. No XP unless online is enough of a 'penalty', although I see it as more of a benefit for being online then a punishment for being off. But it means whilst you could have 3 toons crafting, only one of them will be advancing.

Whilst everyone will dabble, not everyone will master, they wont devote the time or the resources. Even then there are 11 CORE tradeskills to choose from, not everyone is going to be trading in the skill you choose, or the areas you choose, with the recipes you choose and the parts/resources or skill that you find and create for yourself.

A real crafter will search out the finest, someone not interested fully in the crafting will not.

A real crafter will hunt down the recipes he wants and needs for his market, someone not that interested... wont.

Like they said, if you want all the recipes that's a LOT of travelling, for your core skill. You can BE that crafter who has all those recipes.

There's no limit on the craft skills you can level up, all it takes is time which is why people will focus on one or two, you wanna be even better than them? Focus on more.

There's loads of ways you can spread the gap between the commited crafter and the alted builder.


Added Edit
And you'll need to master Science and Nature in order to fully restore and prepare resources to, to get the best product. So there's plenty of room for people to not take advantage of things, which means you will be able to be known as a fantastic crafter, master Science and Nature and Scavenging and then make the best items with the best recipes.

And much more... It'll take a long long long long LONG time to be a master crafter. So many variables and options and recipes.


So in a nutshell, don't worry. I had the same worry and that's why I made the poll thread I Crafter, and even though people say they want a master crafter, look at how hard it is to get there and you know that not everyone will be known as such.

[Madjorin]

I disagree. I do not want there to be only one slot. I do not want crafting to be limited to one toon at a time. No XP unless online is enough of a 'penalty', although I see it as more of a benefit for being online then a punishment for being off. But it means whilst you could have 3 toons crafting, only one of them will be advancing.


I interpret this differently. Based on the dev posting and on the mogarmy video, tradeskills will improve through practice even when offline. But you'll only earn xp from crafting while online - which will level your char for the purpose of training stats and other skills (eg. combat ones).

Which would mean everyone could be levelling multiple tradeskills on alts simultaneously and just about constantly.

[nimrod]

all good to me :D

[Zmeagol]

Seems cool to me =)

[Deost]

The only thing that will limit your tradeskill xp for your alts is resource supply, and how often you can mine/scavenge for parts from the nodes.

So if it's slow, and you can only get so many resources per day - it'll limit how much you can do at one time. Also, there's the factor of the time it takes to make an item.

But, yeah - you could do it on more then one char at a time. But you'll be restricted by your resources in how fast you rise in the tradeskill.

I guess we'll see once beta hits. Whenever that is.

[Richardb]

If you only gain tradeskill xp on a character that is logged in then it would seem your limits arent going to be resources on tradeskill alts but time playing them and that kinda shoots the whole "tradeskill alts" thing in the foot since they would prob need to be logged on far too much to be an "alt" to really get anywhere with crafting. Unless of course you just log him on when you go to bed for the night or something to craft in which case to do that with an alt instead of just leaveing your main crafting wouldnt make much sense to me unless you had "maxxed" your crafting on your main already. Anyway around it it seems it will be quite a bit of time into the game before we will see crafting alts from any but the errr "professional gameing industry".

[Deost]

Well, they've already stated that there is two experience pools.

1. General Abils, Skills, Mutations.
2. Tradeskill.

You get 2 whether you're logged in or not, and have something queued to be made.

You only get 1 ONLY if you're logged in.

So, if you've got the resources: you can alt offline tradeskill. It's just that character recieves 0 general xp for ability usage.

However, higher level recipes will require higher level skills.

So you're going to have to level the alt's attributes so you can access the higher level ones.

But, since Int / Perc are the requirements, and it only takes 300AP to get both there, you're looking at level 20-30 something or so before you can have a max tradeskill alt. Mainly because you'll need some fighting skills to get there.

For general junk (low level ammo, etc) the alt would be fine. For the higher level stuff - you'll need either your main, or the alt you work on.

For efficiency, 2 chars max would be your best bet.

Any more then that, and you're wasting resources.

[Alter]

Well, they've already stated that there is two experience pools.

1. General Abils, Skills, Mutations.
2. Tradeskill.

You get 2 whether you're logged in or not, and have something queued to be made.

You only get 1 ONLY if you're logged in.

Where did they state this?

The post Acropolis made can be read two ways atm. Was it said on Fallenearth.se? :confused:

[Deost]

For each item you make, your tradeskill increases by a variable amount depending on the complexity of the item. Also, you gain experience for crafting items, allowing characters to level up completely by crafting if they wish (though this will take a long time and you have to go out into the world to find many of the recipes) but you only gain experience for crafting done while online.




So, each tradeskill has it's own experience pool, basically. You get a set xp amount for each different item depending on it's complexity.

You also get XP for your "level" that you can use to spend on ap points, etc. But that's only if you're crafting online. Offline, you'd only get the tradeskill xp.

I underlined the part that led me to believe it's 2 pools. Or rather, hmm.

Actually, it's more like.

1. General XP. (Stats, Skills, Mutations) - ONLY when online.
2. Tradeskill you are using. - When online/offline.

So, there's a pool PER tradeskill. You'll ONLY get xp for that tradeskill.

So if you queue up 20 bullet packs, you'd get xp online or offline for them for the Ballistic skill.

If you're online, you'd get some normal xp WHILE you're making them. Offline, you wouldn't.

[Alter]

...or you get no experience or tradeskill increase offline. While I agree with your interpretation I'd like a solid 'Yes thats the way it works' from someone who knows....e.g. a dev or Acropolis. ;)

[Bandaloop]

That sounds really really cool. Of course my initiall thought was "Cars? I want a car..."

[LaughingOtter]

I'm a diehard crafter at heart and this system sounds really interesting. Big guns and fast cars are great, but I really want to hear more about cooking! :D

Anyone for a plate of red-hot wolf nipple chips?

[Breagha]

*blinks*

And here I had almost recovered from Ed's Dingo's Kidney Pie....

[OnassisRyan]

Nice that we can master more then one, I'm for sure planning on weaponry, and Medicine =)

[Makiaveli]

...or you get no experience or tradeskill increase offline. While I agree with your interpretation I'd like a solid 'Yes thats the way it works' from someone who knows....e.g. a dev or Acropolis. ;)

Well since Acropolis never said you need exp to raise the crafting skill. He said the skill will raise based on what you make. "Also" you gain exp...Deost is using the term exp when referring to raising the skill as in you gain "exp" for making the item and when you make enough lvl 5 bullets you will raise your skill. So I think he is right when you look at the words used in the QoTW.

[Database82]

Will every faction be able to make do some type of crafting tradeskill or will that be only restricted to certain factions?

[Bleedingtiger]

As much as I get a kick out maintaining a troupe of alt lackeys I kind of hope they will either limit us to one character or limit us to one character crafting at a time.

while it seems the norm now is to supply each account with 5 characters per server FE might go the way of FFXI in starting you with 1 character and having you pay more per month for extra ones (12.95 per account +1.00 per each additional char)

how did SWG handle it...?

[Kunra]

Sorry for necroing a post but this is what I am most looking forward to in this game. I am a Gatherer by nature and sounds like most everything gatherable item will be useful in some shape or form.

I'm the kind of person who spends his entire game life working for the guild to supply guild members with things that help forward the guild. Basicly, i'm a guild crafters bestest friend. :)

I'm the kind of person who is asked to "farm" for a resource even if it takes many many hours to gather.

[Kunra]

EPIC ****ING NECRO

Wait he appologised...

****

I know, but I was going over all the QotW's again trying to learn everything I can about game and felt compelled to post. :D

[JPatteri]

Necro with a nailgun for teh win!
Ahh, so sweet tradeskills. Can i move to Fallen Earth? Beats this boring it-business dead on :)

[Tenshi]

I LOVE NECROING IF YOU HAVEN'T NOTICED Lol : P


Wowzers : O,
Fallen Earth's crafting system is vastly superior to any other game's
crafting system.
I'm really, really impressed : O.
*drools*
*Has fit*
:blushing:

First,
I'm glad that this game will have realistic looting,
as in you won't be able to loot whole items from monsters : )
I personally could not stand MMORPGs which had ''Level 24 Bears'' droping staffs -.-,
I mean wheres the realism in that ? : O

Harvesting,
I am glad we will be able to harvest many resources : )
I dunno, it's just I have always had fun locating
resources and harvesting them in MMORPGs.
Also this adds a sense of realism to the game as well,
as it shows that resources don't just pop out of the sky ^_^

Wow,
There are so many trade skills!
All the colours of the rainbow!
So many varities!
This is definately a plus in my book : )
This will be awesome, and definately fun!.
But also highly realistic : )

Crafted items are better than looted?
That is a relief,
I hated WoW for creating a time sink of raiding away your life
just so that you could obtain epix.
Being forced to raid is the sux,
THANK YOU : D,
hehe :P.
And also this adds a sense of realism,
as the items had to have come from somewhere : ).

Some rare components only come from certain rare spawns?
Wow, i'm in love here : D
I just love a challenge : D
Good move on your part, Fallen Earth devs : D
*praises*

Recipes,
You guys have done a really great system in terms of recipe learning,
Its highly realistic and is very flexible as you can obtain
recipes in 4 different ways, apparent from the usual 2 or less ways
in other MMORPGs.
Awesome. : )

Thanks for the info!!

[pamkhat]

I'm just now getting into the meat and potatoes of this game so small, informative tidbits like these are super easy to comprehend and quck to read. This was a very helpful post! Thanks!

[NomNom]

In the initial post it was said some items would take longer to complete hours / weeks? I also noticed it said some items will need to you stay in a workshop the entire time it's being crafted? Will there be any interaction (Minigames?) with the crafting or its just auto running while you hang out in a shop?

I'm guessing food and potions go quick maybe something like crafting in Warhammer? I would really like to see some kind of minigames for crafting bigger items whether it be related or even if its just a matching game like meditating in old school everquest.

[Savarage]

I think that most simple things will take a few minutes but for a car and such its more of a long term project where you log out in the shop then log back in and collect resources and play for a while then log off in the workshop to continue crafting the car. So a project that's actually worth some thing in-game both because its really useful and also because its really rare.

[VigarLunaris]

This really sounds like a perfect trade System. So everyone could choose which mastery he or she really prefers and got also the possibility to get the other trade skills a good handy level!

[GenTarkin]

Without a doubt SWG Pre CU had the best tradeskill / crafting system in any mmo in history.
From the original post it sounds like FE will be somewhat similar to the complexity and reward that SWG Pre CU crafting system gave you. Im wondering though...
The most important thing in SWG was every single item created was unique according to the skills and equipment (which in turn was made uniquely) of the creator of the item. This was due to the original bare raw components (harvested, surveyed) all had tons of stats and quality stats that had to be payed attention too and there was experimentation on top of that, to get more and better possibilities in the final result of your creation.

Resources in SWG that needed to be surveyed .. well basically came from a dynamic spwawning table for each individual planet. The resource always changed location and quality.

Then, one could create a blueprint of a prototype and with the same materials put them all in their factory and they could cook out identical items. (except serial numbers were always unique)

So, Im wondering will FE's crafting amount to this detail as mentioned above?

Cuz, imho no other game except SWG Pre CU has captured the need and desire to be a crafter so well. Making it a very integral part of player economy was pulled off like no other mmo in existance.

[Lamb]

Without a doubt SWG Pre CU had the best tradeskill / crafting system in any mmo in history.
From the original post it sounds like FE will be somewhat similar to the complexity and reward that SWG Pre CU crafting system gave you. Im wondering though...
The most important thing in SWG was every single item created was unique according to the skills and equipment (which in turn was made uniquely) of the creator of the item. This was due to the original bare raw components (harvested, surveyed) all had tons of stats and quality stats that had to be payed attention too and there was experimentation on top of that, to get more and better possibilities in the final result of your creation.

Resources in SWG that needed to be surveyed .. well basically came from a dynamic spwawning table for each individual planet. The resource always changed location and quality.

Then, one could create a blueprint of a prototype and with the same materials put them all in their factory and they could cook out identical items. (except serial numbers were always unique)

So, Im wondering will FE's crafting amount to this detail as mentioned above?

Cuz, imho no other game except SWG Pre CU has captured the need and desire to be a crafter so well. Making it a very integral part of player economy was pulled off like no other mmo in existance.

Did you have to use spreadsheets, charts, graphs, statistics to work efficiently? I love it. :w00t:

[GenTarkin]

Did you have to use spreadsheets, charts, graphs, statistics to work efficiently? I love it. :w00t:

Actually, many of the greatest crafters did. Always kept track of minerals quality and current locations on planets. People would actually, once they found resources of the greatest quality, would stockpile them in their house or storage facilities. Then would be either sold, or if they were a crafter they had a supply of rare quality resources that many others would not have unless they told everyone where they were located at that time. This allowed them to make some of the most unique weapons/ armor/ bots/ pets/ food/ ships etc. in that point of time.
Just the dynamic spawn tables / qualities of SWG's Pre CU was one of the best things in an mmo ever. It was one of the few games where you could literally spend all your time crafting / gathering and enjoy it...not feeling like you are missing something else. Because, people knew you for making the high quality items that noone else could made or did not know how. You made a name for yourself as a highly saught after crafter.
I remember reading some of the dev articles about the SWG emu project ( fully legal ) thats being undertaken and the dev said the reason its taking so long is the object system of SWG Pre CU was one of the most complex he'd ever seen in an mmo engine.

[Lamb]

Actually, many of the greatest crafters did. Always kept track of minerals quality and current locations on planets. People would actually, once they found resources of the greatest quality, would stockpile them in their house or storage facilities. Then would be either sold, or if they were a crafter they had a supply of rare quality resources that many others would not have unless they told everyone where they were located at that time. This allowed them to make some of the most unique weapons/ armor/ bots/ pets/ food/ ships etc. in that point of time.
Just the dynamic spawn tables / qualities of SWG's Pre CU was one of the best things in an mmo ever. It was one of the few games where you could literally spend all your time crafting / gathering and enjoy it...not feeling like you are missing something else. Because, people knew you for making the high quality items that noone else could made or did not know how. You made a name for yourself as a highly saught after crafter.
I remember reading some of the dev articles about the SWG emu project ( fully legal ) thats being undertaken and the dev said the reason its taking so long is the object system of SWG Pre CU was one of the most complex he'd ever seen in an mmo engine.

I actually completely agree with you on the implementation of a great crafting system. We need to have something for every player.

By all means what I've heard is that the crafting in FE is going to kick ass. A lot of the boring parts have the option to be automated, and the crafting vector is very complex as is, with multiple grades of raw materials, etc.

But efficiency turns me on. I can't believe I missed swg, I'm hearing so many things about it. What is CU and why is it hated so much?

[GenTarkin]

I actually completely agree with you on the implementation of a great crafting system. We need to have something for every player.

By all means what I've heard is that the crafting in FE is going to kick ass. A lot of the boring parts have the option to be automated, and the crafting vector is very complex as is, with multiple grades of raw materials, etc.

But efficiency turns me on. I can't believe I missed swg, I'm hearing so many things about it. What is CU and why is it hated so much?

See, thats another thing about SWG Pre CU crafting that was awesome, it was effecient. Sure, it took a while experimenting with different grades and stats on resources to get perfect mix and ultimately make your desired stats on a weapon or piece of armor, but once found....you just needed the same resources and then you make a blueprint of your prototype...stick that in your factory with the resources and then it will cook out batches of the same stats as your discovered prototype that you blueprinted. =) so it made the task of making copies of your experimentation very easy, just took time.

SWG has had 3 major stages of its lifetime. There were the PRE Combat Upgrade days when everything was pretty much how people wanted, minus the bugs here and there that needed changed. Then there was Combat Upgrade which majorily revamped the game and dumbed it down a bit, made things a lot more linear and made nearly veryones valuable resources stored up, useless because they redid all the required recipe components. Then there was the kicker to the grave stage: New Game Experience aka NGE....That basically killed the game for every old fashion player and everyone that loved the game that SWG was. It completely took the dynamic crafting system out. It made all classes into a level base system much like WoW. And destroyed everything SWG PreCU was.
Since I think 2002-03, a legit SWG PreCU project started, which split into 4 groups...each making their own emulator, but swgemu is about nearly complete in recreating the entire SWG PreCU experience to the T...that many of us fell in love with.

Ive noticed that FE, I think, is following something very similar as far as class advancement similar to SWG PreCU which is another amazing feature of FE.
SWG PreCU had tons of classes of which you could be any one or several of them if you wished with one character at any time. There were no levels, simply only amounts of experience needed to unlock the next skill box in whatever class tree you were working on.
Every class had meaning in SWG even the simple ones like chef and say dancer/ musician. They all played into the game beautifully. OH HOW I MISS THAT GAME!!!
Hopefully FE will be close to it or allow me to relive the greatness that SWG will never be again (except through the emu).

[Lamb]

That's an interesting story. What motivated the Devs to "improve" their game with CU and NGE? Were they sincerely motivated by trying to improve the experience for the playerbase, or were they just trying to bring in more players?

[GenTarkin]

That's an interesting story. What motivated the Devs to "improve" their game with CU and NGE? Were they sincerely motivated by trying to improve the experience for the playerbase, or were they just trying to bring in more players?


They were basically trying to get more players, this was around the time wow came out and they tried to keep people by making the game more and more like wow. Also, everyone in their forums were a bunch of whiney players that were whining about the way getting jedi was too hard and not known. So yeah, they destroyed the game fired the original development team(thats why they cant go back to how it was).

Another thing that was awesome about PreCU which I forgot to mention was the way you got jedi. It was unknown to almost eveyrone until someone got their for themselves.
When you created your character.. there were I think 4 or 5 professions(classes) you had to master that you only knew about by looting these boxes that very RARELY dropped(forgot their name), throughout the life of your character. Each box told you what profession you had to next master (if you wanted to be come jedi, if you chose) and then the 5th box was a random one....you would have to guess which profession to master. Then the steps to attaining even starting in force training were revealed to you from there. Oh, I know now the boxes were holocrons =).
There were so few jedis in the beginning it was amazing and they were truely characters to fear or not. Jedi's, if they pulled out their lightsaber in public with alot of people standing around were immediately flagged to be attacked. ROFL some fun battles when this happened!
They kept tuning the jedi system during Pre CU and eventually bounty hunters could get actual player jedi bounties from the bounty terminals. They were assigned to hunt down that player accross the galaxy for money...sometimes one jedi had tens and tens of bounty hunters after them.
The way a jedi stayed off the terminals was if they stayed in seclusion or with other jedis during their journey while using their powers and lightsabers.

Gosh everything about that game...omg then there is 100% player created buildings / cities ANYWHERE on ANY PLANET!
You would have rebel vs imperial pvp battles of hundreds of people at their own player created bases with massive ATST's and turrets ... it was truely amazing to experience. Spys were used to sneak into a players base and determine (through hacking) the time of day when that particular base was vunerable... and guilds would plan around that times to attack other player bases.
I mean player created cities was just awesome. Player cities had important roles, such as if your city got large enough you could build a shuttle port allowing more direct travel to and from your city, you could buid hospitals in which people could clone and doc could do stuff in his own private hospital rather than having to visit a big npc city where everyone is. Town halls were there for guild matters and votes and city rules. Also, bases and defense were set up around cities you could deploy npc stormtroopers / ATST's to guard your city and base. Can set up rules to fire on certain people/factions on site. Basically a whole bunch of stuff modern mmos dont offer cept maybe eve but thats space only! =P. People set up vendors in their houses if they were crafters or merchants and you would journey to their vendors just to buy stuff....
Grrr....I could go on and on about swg pre cu. It was truely unique....like I said destroyed forever now by the great SOE gods =/ *******s!!!

[Lamb]

Yeah, we have to hope that doesn't happen to FE. So far, I think they have kept a level head about things. Even though I don't think they're perfect, I'm impressed by the FE crew.

We discussed player construction before. It was something we all really wanted- player forts, etc. But they said it would take up too much in terms of resources. I'm sure this game is much more resource-intensive than SWG.

But they are looking forward to put in things like farming and player constructions in future installments of the game.

When the SWG emu will be finished, will it be subscriber based or free to try?

[GenTarkin]

Yeah, we have to hope that doesn't happen to FE. So far, I think they have kept a level head about things. Even though I don't think they're perfect, I'm impressed by the FE crew.

We discussed player construction before. It was something we all really wanted- player forts, etc. But they said it would take up too much in terms of resources. I'm sure this game is much more resource-intensive than SWG.

But they are looking forward to put in things like farming and player constructions in future installments of the game.

When the SWG emu will be finished, will it be subscriber based or free to try?

There is no ETA on when they will be finished. But they are hoping soon as it can be =)
Right now I would say that 65% of the final game is finished. Its legal and free to play. Its legal because its not based on the current version of the game(meaning its precu instead of NGE). In order to play you will have to purchase the full version of the game.
website is swgemu.com if you wanna check it out =)
Its playable right now as they have tons of people on the test center constantly testing it out =)

[Lamb]

bookmarked. Can't promise I can make time to download it and install it now, but when I have more free time, heck yeah

[silverhaze]

since the good old days at SWG, that passed quite a while ago, i know how important and fun it is to have a well working crafting/resource system

sounds like the devs at FE have the same inspiration about crafting, hope they implement it well

would be just awesome :)

[Abbott]

Sounds interesting.

[Ravendarc]

Crafting is something I love doing. In Star Wars Galaxy I was a tailor. I enjoyed making clothes for players, because I knew I could craft items that were better quality then what dropped off NPC's. Please keep crafting something worth doing.
Good luck.
P.S. Patiently waiting for my Beta invite.:)

[doyley]

very nice post answered alot of questions, thanks!

[Cylock]

Thanks for the info iv'e been wondering bout it for a while.I really hope that with trade skills like these it will keep the RMT's off our backs in this new game.Im from FFXI and it would be great to not have to deal with them!

[Filtertyp]

Basically everything sounds cool here but can someone elobarate:
Really complex items may require the character to remain in the facility for the entire time the item is under construction. ?

Is this true for example for cars? Do i have to stand there for weeks? Or am i supposed to allways log off when I am in a facility and make progress offline, if I want to do other things when I am online?

[Matke47]

Awesome just the stuff i was looking for and in my favorite theme for mmo ( post apoc ;) ) . I cant w8 to see it in action , good work